Topic: Trying to wake up the 5.3 a bit

[02Z71_Tonka]

During the next month I will be adding some new parts to the truck to help get some more kick from it. As of now the truck sits like so: GMPP CAI, 3" Flowmaster 40 catback, and a Hypertech 91Oct tune. Also the stock keys are cranked to allow my 285 Dune Grapplers to fit.

This month I will install myself:
Pacesetter long tube headers with off road pipe
2500 stall torque converter
trans go shift kit

After that is installed I will take the truck to Livernois Motorsports to have installed:
Livernois stage 1 L92 cam 224/230 @ .050 duration  .581/.590 lift and LSA 114
Comp 918 springs
Hardened push rods

After they finish the install they will then strap it on the dyno and get it tuned. 
I'm stoked to get a bit more power because I run the truck out at the Silver Lake Sand Dunes and more power for the dunes is always a plus.

[Main One]

That's a healthy cam.  I'm running a 216/224 at 0.050.  I'd rather have gone a little more than a little less.  Don't know that I'd go as far as you are going.  Am interested in hearing your thoughts after you've had it for a little while.

I've installed a cam and put in a torque converter.  Given that you are doing the torque converter yourself, why are you farming out the cam install?  For me, the hardest part of the cam install was installing dual springs with a cheap spring compressor.  Of course, you don't want to drop a cam sprocket bolt into your oil pan either when doing it like someone else I know....   

[02Z71_Tonka]

The race shop is actually the one who recommended that cam. They gave me a couple options that they said would be the best for the 5.3 and a heavy truck. I'm letting the shop do the cam because being that it is a bigger cam I dont want to drive it untuned for 200 miles to make it to the dyno.

[Main One]

Makes sense.  If nothing else, you will have some idle issues to address.  They will likely also make changes to your VE table, and probably also shift points.

Please post your dyno sheet after the tune.  You should see over 300 hp at the rear wheels I'm guessing.

[MyBigToy]

My personal opinion is that you may want to reconsider that cam for a heavy-a$$ed pig of a truck. The lower-end power will suffer a little with that large of a cam and the 2500 stall probably won't make up the difference, although it will certainly help. It will gain considerably on the upper-rpm power and the power band will be extended upwards of 7000 rpm, if not higher; the stock lifters will only hold about 6200 rpm before they start pumping up and tapping. The stock truck heads don't benefit a lot from a lift of over 0.551". It's your choice, obviously, but you should make sure you do plenty of homework before you make the ultimate decision. Go do some research at PerformanceTrucks.net.

That cam is a more appropriate choice for a Camaro than a naturally aspirated 6000 pound truck IMHO. BTW, welcome to the club. Let us know what you ultimately decide and how satisfied you are with the decision.

[02Z71_Tonka]

Here are the 2 cams the shop gave me the options of:
L92 stage 1  224/230@.050 .581/.590 LSA114
L92 stage 1c  218/229@.050  .600/.600 LSA117.5

They told me stage 1 would give more power up top while retaining what low end I have and a noticeable idle.

Stage 1c would provide more low end and have a normal idle.

I will check out performance trucks though and do some more reading.

[Main One]

I'd ask them what they mean by low end, and if they have any dyno sheets of those cams installed in a 5.3 vice an L92.  It would be nice if the dyno sheets showed where the 2 cams were at say at least down to 2500 rpm or below.  It would be REAL nice if they went down to a good locked up converter cruising speed of say 1500 rpm or below.

My dyno runs have always started around 3500 rpm in order to keep the tranny from downshifting.  I should have done a special tune to have the tranny hold gear at WOT instead of being so downshift happy!   

[KY_BOB]

After that is installed I will take the truck to Livernois Motorsports to have installed:
Livernois stage 1 L92 cam 224/230 @ .050 duration  .581/.590 lift and LSA 114

That is a LOT of cam for a heavy truck and a 2500 converter will not make up for the loss of bottom end torque from that large of a cam.

[KY_BOB]

That's a healthy cam.  I'm running a 216/224 at 0.050.  I'd rather have gone a little more than a little less.  Don't know that I'd go as far as you are going.

Personally, I wish that I had gone with that cam instead of the one that I went with.  It's slightly hotter than mine and just as well mannered.  I'm basing that on 2 trucks that I've been in with that same cam.

Of course, you don't want to drop a cam sprocket bolt into your oil pan either when doing it like someone else I know....   

That would be me that he's refering to.

[Main One]

Bob -

Used my moderator powers to cleanup your post a little bit.  Hope you don't mind.

[KY_BOB]

L92 stage 1c  218/229@.050  .600/.600 LSA117.5

That is a tremendous amount of exhaust duration given the modest amount of intake duration.  That combined with the wide LSA make that cam sound well suited to FI.  That's not to say that it wouldn't be OK naturally aspirated.

I will also agree with MBT in that stock heads don't get as much benefit from very high lift cams as aftermarket heads that are designed for that high of lift.

FWIW: this is the cam that I have:

http://speed-eng.com/store/comp-cam-212218558563-p-1494.html

[Main One]

"Of course, you don't want to drop a cam sprocket bolt into your oil pan either when doing it like someone else I know....   "

That would be me that he's refering to.

That was an interesting day.  Thank goodness you finally found that bolt with the magnet on a stick.  What did it take you, about 45 minutes of fishing with that thing?  Saved us from having to drop your front differential in order to drop the oil pan.

[KY_BOB]

Bob -

Used my moderator powers to cleanup your post a little bit.  Hope you don't mind.

Thanks, I had about forgot how to post.   

[bluedevil]

Thanks, I had about forgot how to post.   

Youre having too much fun on myspace and facebook.

Welcome back Bob

[KY_BOB]

Youre having too much fun on myspace and facebook.

Welcome back Bob

Yea, I know . 

Thanks

[02Z71_Tonka]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_rdc=1&item=260585759368&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm38%26_nkw%3D260585759368%26_sacat%3DSee-All-Categories%26_fvi%3D1&viewitem=
That will be the stall I'm getting for the truck. 3200-3600
Livernois has a LS stage 1 cam that's:
224/224@.050
.568/.568 lift
LSA 114
How would that cam do? I see 224's being run quite a bit.

[Main One]

Make sure the stall will work with the 5.3.  Not saying that it wouldn't, but since it says LT1, not LS1, I'm skeptical.  (The 5.3 shares many components with the LS1.)

I think if you went to a stall that high, I would think that you could use the bigger cams you mentioned.  General driveability and mileage will suffer, but it will be very interesting, and quite fun.

I think that 224/224 cam would do nicely in my truck with my 6-cylinder trailblazer stall at around 2500.

[02Z71_Tonka]

If I can just grab a torque converter from a trailblazer at a junkyard what years of trailblazer do I need? Motor size or tranny matter? Do the trailblazers have different stalls or are they all 2500 stalls?

[Main One]

I'm guessing this one would do the trick:

http://www.performancetrucks.net/forums/showthread.php?t=460682

Bob actually talked me into getting mine - bought it off of someone at performancetrucks.net.

He's got one on his 500 HP at the rear wheels supercharged and nitrous fed monster.  His seems to stall a bit higher than mine.  I guess either because he's got an extra 200 HP at the wheels on me, or he bought one that had been reconditioned some and probably tweaked a bit in the process for his type of application.

[02Z71_Tonka]

So if I stick with the 224/224 cam should I go for the Trailblazer TC or this one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_rdc=1&item=250610085922&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm38%26_nkw%3D250610085922%26_sacat%3DSee-All-Categories%26_fvi%3D1&viewitem=

[KY_BOB]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_rdc=1&item=260585759368&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm38%26_nkw%3D260585759368%26_sacat%3DSee-All-Categories%26_fvi%3D1&viewitem=
That will be the stall I'm getting for the truck. 3200-3600
Livernois has a LS stage 1 cam that's:
224/224@.050
.568/.568 lift
LSA 114
How would that cam do? I see 224's being run quite a bit.

That's probably not a bad match.  It should be a beast.  Don't plan on towing a lot with that loose of a converter.  With that big of a cam, you'll probably stall on the low end of the rating.

I seem to remember Trannyman running a converter along those lines.  He pulled it out because he felt it was a little loose fo everyday driving.

[KY_BOB]

Some people have questioned me using the Trailblazer converter.  All I can say is, so far, so good.

I do have logs, showing 2650-2700 sitting dead still just prior to launching it.

[Main One]

My logs are around 2300 if I recall correctly, versus around 1700 stock.

[Main One]

So if I stick with the 224/224 cam should I go for the Trailblazer TC or this one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_rdc=1&item=250610085922&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fshop.ebay.com%3A80%2F%3F_from%3DR40%26_trksid%3Dm38%26_nkw%3D250610085922%26_sacat%3DSee-All-Categories%26_fvi%3D1&viewitem=

I think either that one or a TB would be a good choice with that cam.

If you were to go with the cam you were originally thinking about, I would think you'd need to either upgrade your fuel injectors, or increase your fuel pressure.  I'm more than maxxed out on my stock injectors in cold weather.

[KY_BOB]

My converter came from the guy that owns this company:

http://www.redstarperformance.com/

I bought it when he was building them and selling them on Ebay.  They were selling quite a bit cheaper then than now.

this is our very own LS1,LS2,4.8,5.3, 0r 6.0 high stall converter. It?s the very converter in our LS7 Tahoe an it?s good for a 2500-3000 rpm stall which will help motivate even a 5500 pound monster. We?ve never had one fail under any application. This will fit a 4L60/65-E transmission. Call or email for specific applications.
 
price: 335.00 no core charge

[Main One]

If you need one for a core charge, I've got a couple stock ones laying around the garage that I could be talked out of for the price of a 6 pack and shipping.   

[MyBigToy]

If you are looking for decent while still relatively cheap converters you might want to check out Yank or Circle D. I've got a Yank TT2600 and it's been a good converter so far. I love the lockup much better versus the stock converter lockup. It flashes right at 2600 in my application.

[02Z71_Tonka]

I ended up buying the one over on PerformanceTrucks.net that Main One had posted a link for. It gets sent out today, so now I need to get my long tubes an y pipe ordered.

[Main One]

If you are looking for decent while still relatively cheap converters you might want to check out Yank or Circle D. I've got a Yank TT2600 and it's been a good converter so far. I love the lockup much better versus the stock converter lockup. It flashes right at 2600 in my application.

You can adjust the lockup in the computer tune.  When I first put in my TB converter, it would slip when locked at about 50 going up a slight incline.  Played around with some transmission settings via HPTuners and it locks up much firmer now.

[Main One]

I ended up buying the one over on PerformanceTrucks.net that Main One had posted a link for. It gets sent out today, so now I need to get my long tubes an y pipe ordered.

I thought I recognized a name over there.   

I've been happy with mine.  I noticed on another thread where someone was looking for a high stall converter someone dissing the TB converters due to issues at WOT with the converter locked.  To that I say, why would you have your computer programmed to keep the converter locked at WOT in the first place?  I'm programmed to only lock the converter in 4th, and I'd have to have the truck going faster than I've ever driven it (110) to have it hit 4th at WOT.  People shatter driveshafts on the 2wd AVs doing dyno runs in 3rd - the driveshaft is only good up to about 125.

Stock, the computer did lock up my converter in 3rd.  After putting in the TB converter, I found it a bit odd that when shifting from locked in 3rd to 4th unlocked, the rpms would increase as the converter was unlocked, then decrease with the shift.  Didn't see this with the tighter stock converter.  May have been there, just not very noticable.  Since I don't do long runs of driving at speeds where the tranny would be running locked in 3rd anyway, I just programmed it to only lock in 4th, and have been very happy with that.  Have had the TB converter in for I think 3 years now, roughly 90,000 miles.

[MyBigToy]

I also did away with the torque converter lockup in 3rd gear. I had to adjust the lockup because the new stall was not locking until about 60 mph when it was installed. It now locks up under light throttle at 45 mph, just like stock. I've found that shift speeds and lockup speeds tends to be a very personal preference item. I like to shift and lock up early under light throttle inputs as it tends to help with gas mileage. You have to play around some with your downshift mph parameters some to get the right balance.

[Main One]

I lock up as early as 35 mph under light throttle.   

[KY_BOB]

I thought I recognized a name over there.   

I've been happy with mine.  I noticed on another thread where someone was looking for a high stall converter someone dissing the TB converters due to issues at WOT with the converter locked.  To that I say, why would you have your computer programmed to keep the converter locked at WOT in the first place?  I'm programmed to only lock the converter in 4th, and I'd have to have the truck going faster than I've ever driven it (110) to have it hit 4th at WOT.  People shatter driveshafts on the 2wd AVs doing dyno runs in 3rd - the driveshaft is only good up to about 125.

Stock, the computer did lock up my converter in 3rd.  After putting in the TB converter, I found it a bit odd that when shifting from locked in 3rd to 4th unlocked, the rpms would increase as the converter was unlocked, then decrease with the shift.  Didn't see this with the tighter stock converter.  May have been there, just not very noticable.  Since I don't do long runs of driving at speeds where the tranny would be running locked in 3rd anyway, I just programmed it to only lock in 4th, and have been very happy with that.  Have had the TB converter in for I think 3 years now, roughly 90,000 miles.

Mine would try to lock at WOT until I adjusted the tune as well.  I say "tried" for a reason.  I shuttered like crazy trying to lock up at WOT behind a motor that was making at least twice the power as what it was made for.

Mine now will never lock at any speed or in any gear above 80% throttle.  (I think it's 80% but regardless, above a set tps %, it won't lock.)